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Mikaylee O’Connor: Principal, Senior Defined Contribution Strategist, PGIM DC Solutions

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Mikaylee O'Connor “One thing that’s at the core of how I operate is a focus on internal versus external gratification. I tend to go above and beyond for my own satisfaction because I have very high standards for myself,” says Mikaylee O’Connor. “Everyone’s way towards internal gratification is different, but I feel that when you do things for yourself, you exude different energy and attract more of what you want.”

Moving From Her Comfort Zone

Growing up in a small Oregon town, O’Connor was put on the Montessori track with an emphasis on independent thinking and hands-on learning. She then skipped middle school, while being home-schooled and spending her time in the stables, riding horses. She graduated high school at 17 and was off to Portland State University.

As a finance graduate, O’Connor joined a local investment consulting firm, RVK, as an investment analyst. She stayed for almost 13 years, working her way up while advising clients on pensions, 401k plans, and endowment foundations, to eventually becoming Head of Defined Contributions (DC). In 2020, she craved a new challenge.

“When you feel like you’re in your comfort zone, it’s the right time to maybe see about getting outside of that comfort zone. I wanted to do more strategic thinking, be a little more creative and be part of a movement to help the DC industry forward and find better solutions for everyday people,” she says.

In the start of 2021, she joined PGIM as a senior DC strategist and, this past February, she became a principal. O’Connor enjoys the ‘think tank’ atmosphere of her team: “We’re always asking, ‘What is the problem out in the market and how can PGIM and Prudential as a company come together to solve these problems and deliver solutions?’”

Embracing the New Challenge

“In my experience, the consulting world is very much for people who like to be constantly challenged,” she notes. “Every client project provides something new – new content, new research, new ways of presenting materials, or simply, adjusting to different personalities.”

O’Connor finds that everything depends upon how you approach those challenges: getting frustrated or seeing each as an invitation to grow. Receiving the support of mentors and advocates has been critical to rolling with new challenges. As she’s become senior, providing that same support to junior associates has been essential and rewarding.

She’s also learned to stay open to what she doesn’t yet know: “If you’re constantly trying to learn new things, you have to be humble to the fact that you don’t know everything,” she advises. “It’s important to surround yourself with different voices and perspectives so that when you’re trying to solve problems or provide solutions, you have that 360-degree view instead of looking only right in front of you.”

Opening to More Possibilities

O’Connor is known to give an unfiltered view of what she is thinking and play her own part in widening the conversation in any meeting.

“I push us to think differently or to have a different view on what we’re trying to solve. I often bring the end-user to the table,” she reflects. “Let’s put ourselves in the position of the person that’s going to be using this product or solution. How would they go about doing this or that?”

Despite being in a predominantly white male industry, O’Connor had the opportunity to work under a female CEO at RVK and with many female shareholders throughout her career. But when becoming involved in industry organizations, the gender skew became salient. Her approach to being underestimated by male peers was simple: “I would feel compassion for them because, at the end of the day, that’s their own challenge, not mine.”

But mostly, she has leveraged being a unique voice in the room to help her challenge the status quo.

“I’ve always been one to point out that just because we’ve done it this way in the past doesn’t mean we need to do it this way going forward. What are we missing? What should we be thinking about differently?” she says. “Having both that fresh perspective and high conviction about thinking about problems and solutions differently doesn’t always make people feel good. But I like a good debate and being uncomfortable talking about things, because we are only going to grow more through it.”

Adapting For Your Audience and Your Team Members

“Whether it’s your boss, client or a prospect, reading the room and adjusting how you approach the situation and your communication style matters to being effective,” says O’Connor.

Being able to adapt to and apply different ways of learning and communicating has been a powerful component in her ability to meet people where they are and create the momentum that drives results. Equally, sitting on the extrovert-introvert cusp, O’Connor highly values adapting her approach to hearing all voices in the room, including considering the different ways they may need to be heard.

“You have extroverts and introverts. You have people who need more time to think and you have people who can come up with ideas right on the spot in the meeting,” she says. “In order to capture all of the different great ideas, concerns and considerations, you have to consider how to make sure that you’re getting what you need from each of them, and that you make them all feel included.”

Reframing for Confidence

Shifting her mindset to increase her confidence has helped O’Connor to take on bigger roles.

“In the past, despite being overly prepared for a client meeting or discussion, I would still feel nervous,” she recalls. “But one mentor in particular assured me, again and again, that I knew more about the topic than anyone in that room. Over time, it shifted my perspective from being the ‘victim of scary stares and expectations’ to a ‘person with important information to share.’ I shifted to see that I’m going in there as a teacher.”

Now she loves to speak in front of an audience and does so often. Another learning curve has been around the challenge of leadership.

“I can be a perfectionist and always want to do things correctly, but when you’re in charge of people and emotions, that’s a different skillset and a different realm of understanding how to deal with things,” she says. “It takes a lot of listening and stepping back to ask how you can best support each of these individuals. Ultimately, their success is also my success.”

She’s also learned to always ask for feedback and to create an environment where people feel comfortable giving it.

Meanwhile, O’Connor has recently been unlearning multi-tasking as a leader: “I’ve been working on mindfulness and there’s a huge benefit to focusing your attention on one thing at a time. I’m much more active and creative when I get rid of distractions.”

Focusing on Internal Gratification

“By focusing on internal gratification, I’ve naturally been given more opportunities without necessarily focusing on what I have to do to get to the next step or to get promoted, because those are external focuses,” she notes. “By doing what I want to do – to grow and to learn and to do it for myself – I’ve just had those opportunities come to me.”

For years, O’Connor has been doing a self-review after meetings to consider whether she could have done anything better or differently. While it can be exhausting, it helps her grow and creates internal gratification.

“I would encourage women to focus internally and not worry so much about external steps and getting to the next one,” she says, “because then you’re doing the work for someone else instead of yourself.”

Being Human, First

O’Connor appreciates how PGIM Quantitative Solutions CEO Linda Gibson shows strength in her role and humanness in her communications.

“Linda has brought a sense of ‘we’re all just people.’ We’re all trying to do the same thing and nobody needs to be on a pedestal,” she says. “She can talk to you in the office just like anybody. It’s refreshing.”

O’Connor observes that since the pandemic and remote offices, more people are breaking down barriers and hierarchy, while seeing everyone as individuals and not just as employees.

“If we want to bring out the best in ourselves, we also have to show that we’re all humans and we all have things going on,” she says. “We can normalize that. But also, how do we take that change and use it to create a more cohesive and better company? Our relationships can be stronger because I can relate to you on something I didn’t know before.”

Speaking of which, O’Connor finds travel to be good for the soul, and enjoys seeking out AirBnBs and boutique stays with her husband while getting out of their comfort zones and taking in the cultures wherever they are exploring, most recently the Swedish Lapland in the forests of the Arctic circle, with saunas and cold plunges. Iceland is another favorite. Closer to home, she likes scouting out new atmospheric spots for a great meal in New York.

By Aimee Hansen

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Anna de Jong: Head, Client Advisory Benelux and Nordics, PGIM Fixed Income

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Anna De Jong“A lot of people will tell you this or that can’t be done, and that goes for your personal and your professional life, but don’t take that as a given,” advises Anna de Jong. “Have the confidence and be strong until you get the answer that works for you.”

De Jong speaks about how the journey you take is what shapes you, the importance of knowing yourself and having the confidence to pursue the important questions.

What Defines You is the Journey You’re On

After growing up in a small village in the north of Holland, where she felt her limbs wanting to stretch even as a girl, de Jong adventured for a half year opportunity in London that became fifteen years between Merrill Lynch, Morgan Stanley and other firms, thriving amidst a diversity of people, experiences, inspiration and opportunities.

Just when she reached the point of considering a move back to Holland for family motivations two years ago, PGIM Fixed Income approached about her current role in the Netherlands, which met the professional trajectory she also wanted. With London life having felt as much like home to her, de Jong reframes the question of where are you from to what it’s really about.

“It’s not where you’re from that matters. It’s just a box that people want to put you in. Ultimately, it’s about the journey that you’re on and the journey that you take that opens doors, or closes them,” she reflects.

It’s About The Personal Factor

The people factor has always magnetized her to her work. “In my field of work, I work for my clients and prospects, and I need to very quickly understand who I’m dealing with and how to progress things,” says de Jong. “You must be able to read people quickly in order to be successful, and that still holds today. I think that human element is what makes me most content in my work.”

De Jong advises that when working closely with others, it’s important to know yourself so you don’t lose your own intentions in any deal or interaction: “I’ve learned you need to hold your ground. You must understand yourself in order to do well professionally, but also personally. That’s a journey I also help other people with: stick with your convictions, yet be open to learning.”

Being approachable is important to de Jong: “I don’t think in different levels. I’ve learned from all walks of life and different parts of business and people,” says de Jong. “I’m always available and listening to everybody around. I am genuinely interested in people, and I think if you can understand what’s going on, then a lot of things make more sense, and it also matters when achieving the right results.”

De Jong notes that while remote working has been validated, being together with your team and clients is invaluable for creating connection and work culture.

“Covid is a lonely time, I think,” she reflects. “And ultimately you spend so much of your time at work. It’s good to see people, but being behind a screen also hides a lot. There’s no longer an excuse for saying that we can’t work from home because we all clearly can, but it’s also important to be with colleagues and have face-to-face time.”

Knowing and Balancing Your Values

“Someone once told me that when your career takes off, something else is going to suffer. For a long time, I was convinced that you have to work very hard while other things would have to take a backseat,” says de Jong. “ I have become of the opinion that’s entirely untrue. You are actually more successful when you understand what is really important to you and cultivate personal satisfaction, as well.”

Years ago, a friend introduced de Jong to a four pillar system. The four pillars represent what is personally important to you and emphasize keeping what matters to you in a balance. She uses the analogy of a chair, it can function with three but ideally needs four legs to be fully stable. For de Jong, she values home and family, friends, work and health: “If one gets out of whack, it makes the rest volatile and you do not perform as well, personally or professionally. It can be a juggling act, but you don’t have to forget about what’s important in your personal life in order to succeed in professional life and vice versa. In a way, they all become one.”

When the work aspect of life becomes too much, de Jong feels it’s important and okay to speak up about that, and not fall into the cultural notion of having to keep everything separate. Personally, she doesn’t resonate with a sense of being “successful” that connotes “achieving the best results regardless.”

De Jong does not perceive that getting the result, no matter what the impact on others or personal life, can ever be success. Rather, she speaks more to harmony and co-creation from a place that is aligned with your internal values.

When it comes to her personal success, “I do my work with lots of pleasure and have happy clients who are keeping and raising assets,” she notes, “but it’s also being home with my daughter and husband. It’s as elementary as that.”

De Jong feels well-matched by the atmosphere at her workspace: “PGIM Fixed Income has this fantastic work culture, that when I joined just felt like a warm blanket – where people work together, give each other challenges and opportunities. It’s been really fantastic.”

With a desire to keep growing, she is curious about pursuing courses in ESG investing and being able to mentor even more in that space.

Guidance For The Journey

“Some guidance that really stuck with me is to ask the same question until you get the right answer,” she notes, having tried this out in areas like promotion as well as anytime you’re immediately told something isn’t possible. “I will continue asking a question until I get the answer that I think works best.”

De Jong tells mentees: “Know, embrace, respect yourself and dare to be different. You have to be yourself, because if you don’t know who you are, then you don’t know where you’re going. It’s the journey you’re on that defines who you are. Embrace that.”

She emphasizes accepting and learning and being willing to let something go when it’s not the right thing. The more honest and non-judging you can be with yourself and others, feels de Jong, the more trust you build and the more you create results together. She has always advised women to be kind to each other, as it can be especially tricky to navigate in banking or finance when you first begin as a woman.

The hardest experience she’s had was in a previous role when she returned from maternity leave only two and a half months after having her daughter, and found part of her region moved from her remit and no expanded team as anticipated. Reflecting, she realizes the feeling that she could only take such a short leave was a red flag in feeling supported.

De Jong feels both men and women can contribute to normalizing parental leave by embracing it, and notes that her own husband has been a huge support.

Vocalize and Invest In Your Needs

De Jong now realizes that earlier in her career, she was often too scared to really ask for what would fulfill her, and so she often got something else. She feels it’s important to be very clear when you’re not satisfied.

“I would get frustrated but nobody seemed to notice, and then I would hand in my resignation and people were so surprised and often disappointed,” says de Jong. “They would ask, ‘why did you not tell me before?’ And I seriously thought I had, but clearly hadn’t been very vocal about my dissatisfaction.”

De Jong enjoys her four-year-old daughter, playing piano and is still looking for an experience in Holland akin to the community volunteer hub she loved in London. Her favorite volunteer work has been a charity she helped create called Launchpad Labs, which offered workspace and mentoring to those with challenging backgrounds.

“Helping others is a great way to stay on your feet to understand the bigger picture and that helps in your personal space and helps with your work,” says de Jong, “It helps to ground those four pillars and understanding what is important.”

She emphasizes investing in yourself and your personal happiness, as well as listening to your body. She loves exercise, baking, and continuing to learn and grow.

By: Aimee Hansen

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