Alison Taylor: Investment Vice President, PGIM Real Estate

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Ali Taylor“The best leaders I’ve seen have always made time for people – regardless of level and the topic of conversation,” says Alison Taylor.

Taylor joined PGIM Real Estate after graduating from the McIntire School of Commerce at the University of Virginia. She had an initial introduction to real estate through prior internships and coursework but found a home at PGIM, and she has grown within the company into a leadership role.

“The longer I worked here and the more I learned, the more interesting real estate became – especially the debt side,” says Taylor. “It surprises me how much I continue to enjoy and feel challenged by the work and the opportunities that have been afforded to me here at PGIM.”

Continuing to Learn Each Day

“No day and no deal are the same,” says Taylor. “Each day presents a different challenge, and I can truly say that I learn something new every single day.”

She loves the variety of her days, which has progressed by the shifting office dynamics during and following the pandemic. As a self-starter, Taylor works independently, pacing herself towards deadlines, which serves in her multi-faceted role. “I have a lot of different responsibilities and work cross-functionally with people across the business, but I’m able to keep on track, juggle a bunch of things and know what needs to be placed on the back burner.”

Taylor feels she brings realness to the table, but she proves that it doesn’t have to hit hard – that people can assert their own opinions while valuing others’.

“I’m very to the point, but not in an aggressive manner. When I was working on the originations side of the business, I was able to pass on a deal or let someone down nicely, but they would still walk away feeling good about themselves,” she says.

Lessons Learned Growing into a Leadership Role

As someone who was driven to grow into a leadership role, Ali shared several tips to help achieve the next level – and beyond – of her career, despite what tensions and challenges she faced.

  • Balance Approachability with Authority

In her ever-evolving role, Taylor notes that being approachable is not only important in showcasing her desire to learn and take on more responsibilities to senior leaders – but it is also important in demonstrating the importance of quality work and strong leadership attributes to her junior team members.

“There can be a double-edged sword as I weave my personal stories into my professional relationships, so I can build and continue to maintain them. I have this ability to connect with younger colleagues who may view me more as a friend while still being able to be taken seriously,” she says. “You need to strike a balance of approachability and authority, so that when we’re actually working on projects and dealing with teams, everyone sees that this is business. I expect very high-quality work and sometimes, we’ll be working late. But I’ll be there right alongside my colleagues.”

Currently, Taylor sees herself straddling the line between taking on the responsibility of seniority and still actually doing the work to show more junior members how it’s done and what’s expected.

“It can be a weird limbo state, where you’re not quite the final decision-maker, but you’re experienced enough to know what will drive successful outcomes for the company,” she says. “That can be a challenge day-to-day.”

  • Own Boundaries and Your Availability

As she has risen through the ranks, Taylor has started to learn the art of delegation and saying ‘no.’

“When you’re junior and hungry, you work late, so you can take it all on. However, I think it serves your growth to start setting boundaries as you advance. I don’t have children yet, but I am still going to sign off at a reasonable time and have a nice dinner with my husband,” she says. “You need to set boundaries, and sometimes, it means saying no or that you’ll look into something at a later time – as your schedule and workload permits.”

She notes this is especially important after working remotely during the pandemic, which created an expectation of 24/7 availability.

“It’s important to not always be accessible via setting clear boundaries, such as calendar blocks and/or letting colleagues know you’ll get back to them,” she says. “Once you’ve reached a certain point, where people know you are responsive and trustworthy, you can put those boundaries in place, and there’s something powerful about that.”

  • Find Power in the Pause

Recently, Taylor received the feedback that she needs to work on being too responsive. Rather than going with her gut reaction to respond immediately, she was advised that, ‘Sometimes, you need to sit on things to let both parties think. Once you have, you’ll come to a better conclusion.’

Receiving that advice was somewhat liberating, as Taylor has realized some matters work themselves out over a walk or a ponder, without needing immediate response or engagement. Plus, she notes her initial gut response is not always the most thoughtful or comprehensive.

Leading with Connection and Collaboration

“Everyone talks about how male-dominated commercial real estate is, but I feel like I’ve worked at a company with better gender balance and that helps grow and support female leaders, which has been amazing,” says Taylor. She has been shown that it’s okay to leave work for a priority at home or family activity to attend to.

“The best leaders I’ve seen have always made time for people – regardless of level and the topic of conversation,” she says. “When meeting with senior leaders, I feel like they’ve given me their undivided attention, which shows me they care and want to help me learn and succeed.”

In fact, even though she often finds herself in back-to-back meetings, Taylor makes relationship-building one of her top priorities, dedicating time to foster connections – no matter the workload.

When it comes to the PGIM work culture, she enjoys being surrounded by smart people who are willing to put in the work to get the job done, while also respecting personal boundaries and valuing work-life balance.

“The structure is not very hierarchical in that everyone is very accessible up to the MD level. For being within a Fortune 500 company, it feels like a lean entrepreneurial structure,” she observes. “Everyone is trying to advance our initiatives and share information, so it’s a very collaborative environment. It fits well with my personality, which is probably why I’ve been here for more than a decade.”

Acting As a Chameleon – Leveraging Her Strength of Adaptability

When thrown into new situations, Taylor remembers what a previous manager told her – that she adapts well to a new environment because not only does she take her responsibilities very seriously and make intelligent decisions, but she also knows when she needs to ask for help. Although some may find asking for help to be a weakness, it’s something Taylor considers to be a strength, enabling her to better understand her work or situation she is facing.

In her career thus far, the ability to assess and adapt to situations has enabled her not to stress the small stuff as much. She admits that it used to bother her if she wasn’t invited to a property tour or closing dinner after a deal she’d worked hard on, but after a few years, she realized that more than enough invitations will come along – so there’s no need to covet them.

“At a certain point in your career, you’re being asked to travel to this and that. You’ll have too many things to attend and will be pulled in different directions,” she says. “It’s a thirty- or forty-year career, so you don’t have to do it all within your first couple years. Just put your head down, do the work and form those relationships because it’s a small sector and everyone’s paths cross again.”

Be Yourself, Everywhere

When it comes to looking ahead, Taylor aspires to continue rising into leadership roles and gain more people-management experience. She also hopes to continue doing the things she loves, such as traveling to new places, curling up with a good book (her most recent read is Rules of Civility, after reading A Gentleman in Moscow by the same author) and working out – all activities that she attributes to keeping her mental health strong.

She loves traveling and planning international trips and visited Dubai and the Maldives in January for her own honeymoon.

Morning workouts are an important part of her routine to maintain balance, and she especially enjoys boxing as an energy outlet.

Taylor once heard that the most successful people are the same exact selves in their personal lives as professional lives.

“You don’t have to come in like a professional bulldog and run the show if that’s not really your personality. You can still be successful,” she says. “The mentors that have most inspired me blend both worlds and stay true to themselves.”

By Aimee Hansen

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Graciella Dominguez: Vice President of Investment Operations, Operations and Innovations, PGIM

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Graciella Dominguez“Lean into all experiences, professionally and personally,” says Graciella Dominguez. “Find the opportunity to grow from everything you experience, channel those lessons, and then use them to do good.”

From Numbers to Relationships

Dominguez was drawn to accounting due to her love of numbers – concepts like credits and debits that felt concrete and measurable. She began working for Ernst & Young while in college, and then joined Prudential a year after graduating. After switching to a smaller firm for a few years to try out auditing, she returned to PGIM, Prudential’s global asset management firm, where she has been for 23 years.

“That brief experience in auditing really challenged me and gave me a lot of confidence in going to different places, interacting with different people and tracking with different levels,” she says. “It was pivotal for my career, but it wasn’t for me long-term, so I brought what I learned back to PGIM.”

PGIM has grown tremendously during her career, and so has she. Although Dominguez went into accounting because of a love for numbers, her work focused just as much on supporting people as she stepped into leadership.

“You really have to push yourself in areas of unexpected growth. When I started as an accountant, I didn’t realize that interacting with people and building relationships was going to be more central to my experience,” she says. “I have been able to grow my relationships, and they are so important – and rewarding – in accomplishing greater things.”

Facing the Toughest Experiences as a Mother

“What has been most pivotal in my career, and truly in my life, was when I became a mom,” says Dominguez. When it comes to the challenge of dividing your energies between work and home as a working mother, nobody understands what that means more than she does. She lost her 11 year-old son, Alexander, five years ago. Throughout her son’s life journey, Dominguez worked, mostly full-time. One of her key motivators was providing for her son and his needs.

“I think we as women have to lean into all of our experiences. For me, that included leaning into being a mom of a child with special needs. It shaped me both as a person and as a professional,” she says. “I learned from his great strength, determination and courage in his short life.”

Alexander was born medically fragile, immunocompromised, hearing impaired, legally blind and ultimately unable to walk. While parenting a child with several medical needs, Dominguez had to find her voice in advocating for what was important when it mattered most.

“Being a mom to a child with so many medical complexities gave me the confidence to speak up and say, ‘No, I don’t agree with that. I don’t agree with how you’re going to treat my son,’” she says. “And that same confidence to speak up for what I believe crossed over into my work.”

Her motherhood has also inspired her to be a more empathetic leader. “As a leader, I’m more compassionate now,” she says. “Because I understand that people have so much more going on than you see at work. You don’t know the challenges people are facing day in and day out. Everybody has a story.”

She continues, “But at the same time I also expect a lot from people, because I saw my son, who was completely disabled, and his friends who faced the same conditions, show up for school every day with a smile and ready to work. That inspired me and really shaped me. Witnessing that has given me the courage to face anything. That is how I honor his legacy to make him proud.”

Dominguez describes her son as a social butterfly with a sparkling personality and smile that shone through no matter what challenges life threw at him. Knowing him has pushed her to get out of her comfort zone – as an introverted person – and show up more with her own voice to share her story and her son’s legacy.

“I hope sharing my story can inspire people to learn how both amazing and fragile life is,” she reflects. “We all have these gifts and abilities to do good things, so never take that for granted.”

Working with Integrity as a Core Value

Being detail- and research-oriented has supported Dominguez throughout her career, as well as her principle of doing due diligence for the work and her clients. Integrity is the most important value to her – being who you are, being true to yourself and leaning into your experiences.

As such, Dominguez is inspired by leaders who show openness and truly embody their words and what they stand for. “I admire the leaders who truly act and behave from who they say they are and who show up as their authentic selves,” she says. “I respect integrity.”

When approaching any challenge, Dominguez emphasizes process – taking the necessary extra steps and knowing the why behind every decision you make. This comes to the forefront especially when bringing junior members on board – helping them learn processes in a way that helps them appreciate each step and helping them question each decision. She aims to always rise to the challenge to do the best, most complete job for the task at hand.

Using Her Voice as a Latina Woman

As the daughter of Cuban immigrants, Dominguez prizes hard work. “My family came to this country seeking freedom, and that’s not lost on me. My family left everything and sacrificed so much. Their experience instilled in me a strong work ethic,” she says. “My grandparents and my parents (who immigrated as adolescents) understood the importance of education and hard work to succeed amidst challenges, and that drives me. I want to honor their legacy, and my son’s, with how I show up in my own life.”

Dominguez appreciates working in a culture that also values high integrity and high standards, and emphasizes diversity and inclusion. She is also co-founder of the PGIM Operations & Innovation Latinx Networking group.

“Representation is really important to me as a Latina woman. Earlier in my career I used to observe women in more senior positions. I love working for a company that really values diversity of backgrounds and perspectives, and puts so much effort into their initiatives for diversity and inclusion,” she says. “It’s really important to me to use my voice and honor all the women who paved the way for me. I am also trying to pave the way for other women. I don’t take that responsibility lightly.”

For those beginning to make their mark in the professional world, whom she also learns from, she advises, “Be yourself. Hard work and integrity pay off at the end of the day. Be yourself and be open to possibilities.”

Reflecting back she says, “I wish I would have been kinder to myself as a young mom. Challenges can look so big sometimes, but you will climb them and be successful, and it’s going to be OK.”

Kindness, More Kindness, and Service

“The more I go through life, the more I realize we do not know what challenges people have every day,” reiterates Dominguez. “So above all, we need to practice kindness towards ourselves and others.”

Classically trained in piano, Dominguez has also returned to playing piano since leaving it behind in her early 20s. She is remembering how to read music again and starting out first with greatest hits.

Born and raised in New Jersey, Dominguez is passionate about volunteerism and giving back to the community. She is on the finance council and works with children at her church. In honor of Alexander’s birthday each year, Dominguez and her husband collect and donate books to Cooperman Barnabas Medical Center, the local hospital where their son spent so much of his time.

By Aimee Hansen

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Claudia Vazquez: Founder, elevink

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Claudia Vazquez“What I saw as a disadvantage at the beginning, I turned it around to make my secret weapon, because I realized this is what makes me unique and able to see things from a different perspective,” says Claudia Vazquez. “I turned my disadvantage into my differentiator.”

As part of celebrating Hispanic Heritage, we open our Latina Leader series with inspired sharing from Claudia Vazquez: her vision for Hispanic inclusion and lifting others up with her!

A Vision For Service

If you only read her official business roles across the years, you’ll know at best half of what Vazquez has truly been up to in the workplace.

Originally from Mexico, Vazquez came to the U.S. in her twenties, teaching English as a second language and volunteering as a citizenship instructor. When she began her career 22 years ago in disability claims at Unum, she immediately saw how she could leverage her bicultural/ bilingual assets to better serve the company and the Hispanic community.

Rather than going with the status quo process of using a third party translator, she began to field all calls from Spanish-speaking clients around disability claims. She then led the implementation of the Hispanic Initiative to create end-to-end bilingual services, eliminating cost and time inefficiencies of outsourcing. Within seven years, she went from claims specialist to heading up the Short Term Disability and Administrative operations in her field office in California.

“I didn’t approach with a diversity mindset. I approached with a service perspective,” reflects Vazquez. “I realized we could improve the service, have more loyal and satisfied customers, and use it as a selling point with clients. It also gave Spanish-speaking employees an opportunity to go above and beyond, support their community and receive recognition for speaking another language.”

When she moved to her next role at Cigna, she replicated this thinking and was asked to find more people with an intrapreneurial mindset like hers. She began to support the recruiting team in Hispanic outreach, emphasizing the importance of representation: “Nobody grows up thinking I want to work at an insurance company,” she argued. “So if we don’t personally represent what we’re trying to attract them to do, this is not a natural fit.”

Moving to the East Cost for a role in Prudential’s head offices, Vazquez enrolled into the Hispanic BRG on her second day. Within six months, she was co-leading the BRG and soon increased membership from 400 to 1000 – while creating best practices, relationship with hiring teams, and outreach to external partners.

“As my passion for supporting the Hispanic community at work evolved, I realized we have to start grassroots and then let things organically develop, so that a ripple effect is created,” says Vazquez. She began to focus on seeding the momentum that allowed partnerships to prove their value as they grew. With this approach, the Red Shoe movement proved so successful that it caught leadership attention and she traveled to Mexico and Brazil to highlight and expand the partnership.

An Advocate for Hispanic Inclusion

As a Hispanic Initiative officer, Vazquez saw the impact of bringing in change-agent partners. She began to shift to building those external relationships such as with We Are All Human and became a Hispanic Star Ambassador. As such, Vazquez has attended the United Nations as part of the delegation to roll out the Hispanic Star unifying symbol and platform to advance Hispanics in the US.

Despite a strong track record of following her mission towards inclusion, only in March did Vazquez formally move from senior business roles to take on a VP of Diversity and Inclusion role. In the role, she developed a strategic roadmap for inclusion on hiring, retaining, developing and celebrating Hispanic talent, laying out both fundamentals and execution strategies.

“I have a passion towards supporting the Hispanic community, but I also see it as a business imperative in the US. Anyone that’s not attuning to Hispanics is going to lose market share,” says Vazquez, pointing out Hispanics make up one of every five people and growing.

Vazquez also iterates that attracting early loyalty among the Hispanic community is critical, because word of mouth and following the family or neighbor recommendations are huge influences on decision-making.

Lifting Others Up With Her

As a Hispanic BRG leader, Vazquez also leveraged the opportunity to mentor and sponsor others in the workplace. She brought more visibility to group members by creating project management opportunities – with clear job descriptions and weekly time investment required – and then by updating their managers about the impacts they were delivering.

“This gave their managers an opportunity to see their employees from a completely different angle of perspective that they had not necessarily experienced directly with them,” says Vazquez. “I wanted to make sure people saw they had everything it took. They just sometimes needed to be able to sell or position themselves differently.”

Vazquez emphasizes staying connected to your own essence and North Star. “I’ve promised myself that regardless of how fast or how far I’m going, I’m still going to be me and not forget where I came from. And I’m not going to forget that there are many individuals still looking to find their path.”

This is what drives Vazquez in her personal mission that co-exists with the day job. It’s why she shares her story to inspire students through HISPA. It’s why she’s available if someone reaches to her on Linked In. It’s why she founded elevink to mentor younger generations on mindfulness, creating a personal brand, and challenging them to envision their future so they begin to steer their choices and energies in that direction.

Owning Her Voice

“Sometimes we question ourselves and protect ourselves because we’ve been through so much. In my case, I’ve been working since I was 14 in Mexico to help my mom, I paid for my education, I left my family to come to the US with English as my second language, I began working with an associates degree and studied full-time while working, so there are sacrifices,” says Vazquez. “But if I had the confidence in my 20s I have now, I don’t know how much larger the impact could be.”

She continues, “We need to trust our gut. We know exactly where we see ourselves, but sometimes we’re afraid to share that vision,” she says. “We just need to move confidently in the pursuit of our dreams. From every setback, we can learn.”

Often the only Hispanic at the table, Vazquez never gives up the vision. Instead, she allows time to pass and looks for new opportunities and angles to pursue: “After many years of navigating Fortune 500 companies, I have learned how I need to approach certain things, and I also understand that change is difficult. Companies will be ready at a certain time, and when they are, things will happen.”

Reflecting on her own journey: “After 25 years of revalidating, I have nothing to lose and a lot to gain. I’ve become more of an unapologetic Latina who stays optimistic about our future possibilities, but it took me 22 years of going through this journey to realize that it’s my life, it’s my vision, it’s my calling.”

Vazquez has learned to take herself a little less seriously. She recently returned from a self-care trip to California with her mother and sister, leaving her husband and three children back at home. She recommends taking the time to celebrate your achievements.

As for her vision: “I’m still getting closer to where I ultimately see myself: as a CEO of a nonprofit organization that caters to Hispanics. That’s what I’m aiming and preparing myself for in the long run. My goal is to leave a mark in the evolution of Hispanics in the US.”

By Aimee Hansen

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Rupal Shah: Principal, PGIM Fixed Income

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Rupal ShahRupal Shah describes her journey, which includes taking uncomfortable (but intentional) leaps in her career, finding her voice, staying challenged, humble and authentic, and dedicating her time to the service of others.

“Create the greatest, grandest vision possible for your life and career because you become what you believe.”

Big Leaps to Follow Her Own Compass

Shah’s parents immigrated to the U.S. from India with master’s degrees and not much else. Her childhood is defined by watching and learning from their hard work and sacrifice. “My parents’ determination and perseverance are in my DNA. They each worked multiple jobs and navigated innumerous obstacles as foreigners in a new country. They had a vision of a life they wanted to give our family and they manifested that vision.”

She lives by the lessons that her parents taught her with their actions. Similarly, Shah paved her own career path, learned from her mistakes and was able to navigate the challenges she faced along the way on her own. “Create the greatest, grandest vision possible for your life and career because you become what you believe.”

Shah recounts, “Each step of my career taught me meaningful characteristics about myself and helped me make my next leap.” Shah spent some of her earlier years in back-office roles within Goldman Sachs, ultimately transitioning to an analytical role within the sales and trading division. Simultaneously, she was getting her MBA part-time at New York University’s Stern School of Business. Despite the hectic schedule, she learned the importance of networking with people around the firm to learn about their roles. It was through these conversations that she was able to determine where she wanted to lead her career path.

“The time spent networking paid dividends and those relationships are my currency,” she says. Post graduate school, after 32 interviews and various naysayers, Shah was given an opportunity to cover strategic relationships within Goldman Sachs’ Asset Management Division, despite various senior professionals deterring her from applying for the opportunity.

“The firm told me they were taking a leap of faith on me. As appreciative as I was of the opportunity, I felt like the underdog. If nothing else, this motivated me to work harder to succeed. There were many times during my career where I was told I couldn’t, or I shouldn’t, or I wasn’t included. I would tell myself that I do not need a seat at that table, I will just build my own. I realized I needed to trust my instinct, and rather than any firm taking a leap of faith on me, I would take leap of faith on myself.”

“Your career is your own. Make sure you’re the one driving it.”

As an Indian American woman in fixed income, Shah has had to reach beyond her comfort zone and override both self-doubt and conditioning, to find her voice. While the context can be intimidating, she realized she had to stop putting up extra hurdles for herself and trust her instincts.

“In my culture, we were raised to not challenge or question anything. We were taught that respect was blindly listening to your elders. But I saw time and time again how this learned behavior would be a detriment to my career,” says Shah.

“In my first few roles, I was scared to ask questions or challenge others. I remember having hard days and I would not speak up when there was something that needed to be said. These situations continued over the years, and I learned that what I had to offer was valuable. I forced myself to develop a voice and really stick to what I believe in and be authentic in that. More than ever, I know my voice matters. It’s been a long path to get here but I see the rewards of taking a view and sticking to it with certainty.”

When thinking back on the journey, she’d encourage her younger self to develop that confidence sooner. “The young women we interview today are so confident and impressive, and I love seeing that.”

Staying Challenged

Shah’s mantra is “if you’re not challenged, you’re not growing.” She continuously asks herself if she feels comfortable in roles. If the answer is yes, she knows she is not evolving. “Comfort becomes shackles to growth. I always want to step so far out of my comfort zone that I forget how to get back.”

Recently, Shah was given the opportunity to build the third-party insurance business for PGIM Fixed Income. Shah has had to push herself out of her comfort zone and trust the strength and skills she has developed over the years. “It’s rewarding to have been able to forge a path that truly will be successful for our firm. I’m incredibly excited to strategically build something new. I’ve been blessed with great opportunities to build and create throughout my career, but this is certainly a new frontier. Thinking of new ideas, strategies, products, building a new team and learning different concepts is challenging and exhilarating.”

“It is important to stay humble and authentic to yourself to be a strong leader.”

Since Shah joined PGIM Fixed Income, she has been involved in recruiting, hiring, and retaining talent. “Our people are our biggest asset. Hiring, training, and nurturing our talent is our greatest responsibility. When people come to work, they should love being here. I want people not only to feel motivated about their work product but also by the work environment,” says Shah. “I’m a huge believer that each person is treated like an individual and should feel empowered. I really nurture my relationships, and that’s a huge part of my leadership.”

“I’ve worked for some truly inspirational people that have shown me the type of leader I want to be. I picked traits along the way and found the style that I felt truly represented the person I am. I lead with kindness and respect, I am the first one to admit when I am wrong, and I embrace that we are all continuously evolving.” Being an authentic leader helps garner mutual respect amongst the team and her leadership is what Shah deems to be her greatest success.

The Most Rewarding Work

As a mother of two, Shah navigates a thriving career, being a fully present mother, running marathons and co-running a charity. Shah says, “It certainly is not easy, but if it’s not hard, it’s not worth it.”

Orphan Life Foundation is the charity Shah co-leads. Her contribution involves supporting orphaned children in India and Burkina Faso from providing basic human needs such as food, clothing, bedding, etc to larger projects such as installing water filtration systems and providing bikes as transport to school.

As a child, Shah’s parents took her family to India every two years. They would visit an orphanage near her father’s hometown and contribute to support the children. The trips were so much more than visiting family.

“It kept me close to my roots, truly humbled me and filled me with gratitude for the opportunities I would have ahead. Those trips really define who I am today,” Shah says. Her charity work continues this tradition, including visits to India.

Shah is currently working on setting up a mentor program between the orphanage in Burkina Faso and a local school in Newark that she has spent time with over the years. She wishes to gift her own children the relative perspective of gratitude for the life they have, the hard work and effort it takes to succeed, and awareness of helping others who were not born into the same.

“This is what I do for me,” says Shah. “I love my career, my family, and the impact I can make. It’s all so exhilarating, but nothing really rewards like this.”

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Ivy Tsui: Director of Program Management for DE&I, PGIM Real Estate

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Ivy Tsui“It is very important to have a sponsor for your career” says Ivy Tsui. “You need somebody to advocate for you and be your voice in places where maybe you don’t have a voice.”

Tsui speaks to staying open and authentic, asking for sponsorship and embodying inclusion.

From Banking to Inclusion

“I have always been open to different opportunities beginning from early on in my career to now–because where you end up may not be where you thought you would go,” she advises. “Life is a journey and it’s not always linear.” Tsui’s parents immigrated to the US from Taiwan and Hong Kong, and she has learned a lot from their adaptability and unwavering spirit.

Tsui started out in banking after obtaining her dual-major bachelor’s degree in economics and international relations at Wellesley College. Tsui spent the first 14 years of her career at J.P. Morgan, and crossed many different disciplines–eventually landing in human resources–while obtaining her master’s degree in organizational psychology from Teacher’s College, Columbia University. In 2017, Tsui made the move to PGIM Real Estate.

While DE&I has always been an aspect of her HR work, in April, Tsui joined a new team headed by Christy Lockridge–the first Chief Diversity, Equity and Inclusion Officer of PGIM Real Estate–which is focused on advancing diversity, equity and inclusion in five key areas of impact: Talent, Culture, Industry, Investing, and Community. To Tsui, the new role feels like a culmination of her professional and personal experiences, especially as an Asian American woman.

Tsui is passionate about how the work of the DE&I team impacts people directly, and she’s especially energized about building a diverse pipeline of early talent. One of her key programs is the PGIM Real Estate Sophomore Training Program (STP), which gives college students early exposure, training and experience in the real estate industry–an industry that has historically not been very diverse. Tsui noticed the need to introduce real estate to students before their junior year (when students usually apply for internships) and has tripled the number of sophomore interns in the past four years.

“We often see students majoring in real estate because of a family member in the business. STP provides sophomores from diverse backgrounds, who otherwise may not know about real estate as a career possibility, the opportunity to work in real estate asset management.” says Tsui. “Some may not stay in real estate, but it opens a lot of different doors for them regardless.”

Being Open and Authentic

Tsui accredits her openness, adaptability and flexibility to her diverse and varied experiences: “I’ve never strategized about how this or that will bring me to the next level. I’ve been more interested in learning new things–sometimes, you have to take a step back or go lateral to really develop yourself.”

“I’ve always found people feel comfortable to talk and open up with me, and I make connections quite easily, and am able to meet people where they are at, which is quite a valuable skill in the HR and DE&I spaces.”

Describing herself as unconventional and an extroverted introvert, with a quirky sense of humor, Tsui has stayed true to herself and feels she has grown in self-confidence with time.

“One of the biggest pieces of advice to my younger self would be to let go of the fear to share my opinion,” says Tsui. “Early in my career, I was more conservative in offering my perspective and spoke only if I had the perfect comment. I’ve realized it’s okay to not always have the right answer or right idea, but it’s important to use your voice. There is power, value and hopefully impact, in sharing diverse perspectives.”

Tsui encourages mentees to do the same: “It doesn’t matter if you’re a junior level person in a room of more seasoned executives, you’ve been given a seat at the table for a reason and it is in the firm’s best interest to encourage and embrace your perspective. You have valuable things to say, so don’t sit in the background. Use your voice, early on.”

Asking For Sponsorship

Tsui absolutely recognizes the importance of being championed at work. She cites the difference between mentorship and sponsorship as critical: a mentor is someone who provides you with career advice and feedback and a sponsor is someone who directly advocates for you in your career development, whether for a promotion or an opportunity.

She encourages employees to have mentors and a sponsor but while she’s had highly valuable informal mentors, she has never had either a formal mentor nor a sponsor, and never asked for one.

“I think that’s partly because as an Asian American female, we’re taught ‘Just put your head down, work hard, do a good job and you’ll be rewarded or at least you won’t fail. Don’t ask for anything more and don’t rock the boat.’ But that doesn’t work.”

Tsui wishes someone had nudged her towards the advice she now gives: “My advice to everyone, but especially to Asian American women and people of color, is that you have to be in control of your own career and vocalize what you want. Even if it’s uncomfortable, you have to find mentors, formally or informally, and you absolutely need to find a sponsor.”

“I’ve learned that it’s important to be your own best advocate. Communication is key to ensure my manager and leaders in my group are informed of what I’m doing and know what my future interests are. This helps keep me in mind for both additional responsibilities and stretch opportunities.”

Embodying Inclusion

“As I’ve moved up, I’ve felt it’s increasingly important to make sure that all voices are heard. If a few people are dominating the Zoom conversation, and I see someone trying to speak or someone who doesn’t often speak, I will try to bring them in and have their voice included,” says Tsui. “When I was in that junior position, I would have loved if someone would have asked for my thoughts, so now I have that opportunity.”

Tsui also makes a point of saying hello to everybody she passes. And while it might seem basic, she notes you’d be surprised how often people just walk past each other. Especially as the senior person, it can help to create inclusion by simply acknowledging the more junior people you pass by.

Another regular practice is to thank people for their contributions in public to increase recognition. She also may draw a more hesitant person into a group conversation while at a networking opportunity.

“Much of this comes naturally to me, but some of it, I do with intent–especially if I see an opportunity to lead by example,” says Tsui.

Choosing Her Own Path

Tsui was advised by a current mentor not to compare her life or her career path to others, and that advice has served. Throughout her career, she’s made choices that were not linear, but were aligned to her personal desires–whether a lateral move to an opportunity outside of her comfort zone, time out of her career after having her third child, or choosing her location based on family-work rhythm.

“I made all those decisions based on what was more important for me at each of those times and they did have trade-offs – whether it was a less competitive salary or getting that more senior title, sooner,” notes Tsui. “But I am happier because of those experiences and grateful for them. This was my path, and I don’t compare myself to peers who chose a different path.”

Tsui met her Colombian husband, who was raised in Brazil, during her early investment banking years. They have three children – Sofia, 15, Bruno, 12 and Emma, 6. At any given time in her house, there’s a combination of Spanish, Portuguese and Mandarin being spoken. Based in New Jersey, she loves visiting her parents and sisters in California, and considers them to be a bicoastal family. She plays piano, and recently played Christmas Eve/Sarajevo 12/24 by the Trans-Siberian Orchestra with her nieces and nephew, although ballads are her usual jam.

By Aimee Hansen

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Brandi Boatner: Manager, Digital & Advocacy Communications, IBM

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Brandi Boatner“You’ve got to remain true to yourself, because there are enough people telling you what you can’t do. I will always tell you what you can do,” Brandi Boatner tells young black women. “We’re going to make change together, but you have to be true to yourself. You have to be authentic. If you’re not, what’s the point?”

Boatner speaks to how the standards have changed for social media and social justice, owning your uniqueness as a black woman, opening the door for others and living through hard-earned resilience in New Orleans.

From People Person to PR Person

Boatner has always been a people person. Fascinated with physics, she started out as a physics pre-med major, until she realized being alone with lasers in the lab wasn’t her happy place. While she wasn’t drawn by the image of a public relations (PR) woman, Boatner was attracted to interacting with people and influencing behavior and has been enamored ever since.

“I love the work, I love the people, and using technology to impact and make the world better feeds my soul,” she says of twelve years at IBM. Boatner began when brands were just finding their footing in using social media to create awareness and drive business, and she’s been fascinated by how social media changed in the last two years as organizations had to discover how to communicate and live their values online.

“Once the pandemic happened, everyone had to shift their social strategies: it was no longer about product, but people. You had to be empathetic, sympathetic and not tone deaf to what was happening in the world,” she says. “Now you’re seeing more posts with purpose. You’re seeing the platform being used to stay in touch and informed, and to stay aligned to values.”

Brands Becoming Value Advocates

In the wake of George Floyd’s death, companies were given a wake up call to be more accountable to identifying, communicating and living their values, which also shifted her role when it comes to leading social justice communications.

“If in today’s environment, you as a brand are not sharing your values and what you believe in on social media, that’s problematic. If you are not speaking out against injustice, discrimination and bias, which we all have, that is problematic,” says Boatner. “Today, companies have to advocate not only for the brand but also for what their employees expect them to advocate for: What are your brand values? What do you stand for? What do you stand against?“

Born and raised in New Orleans, she has internalized Southern values such as approaching other with genuine friendliness, not prying on topics such as politics and religion, and looking to the brighter side for opportunity: “I say PR is the ER, because there’s always something happening. It may be easy to say ‘this is the worst thing to happen’, but I always ask, ‘what’s the lesson to be learned, what are we taking away?’ Yes, we will come to a resolution, but what can we learn and do differently?”

Elevating Social Justice and Action on DEI

Boatner is proud to have led the catalyst Emb(race) pledge, working with senior leadership, which launched on June 1st 2020, in which “IBM and IBMers stand with the Black community and call for change to ensure racial equality”- a campaign for policy change and opportunity creation “to help transform this moment of clarity into lasting change.” The effort has expanded to support other race and ethnic communities, including AAPI.

Launched in September 2020 to transform workplace dynamics, she’s been supporting key initiatives for the Transformation and Culture function, focused on growth, inclusion, innovation and feedback. The function’s mission is led by Obed Louissaint, one of her mentors and a black executive at IBM whose role became the SVP of Transformation and Culture.

“HR is a huge juggernaut,” says Boatner. “So how do you carve out a role specifically looking at organizational culture? I have the distinct pleasure to support Louissant’s team with external and social activities and help drive culture change within the company.”

Honored as a changemaker in 2021 by PRNEWS, Boatner observes 2020 brought an impossible-to-unsee reckoning: “It was time to have the uncomfortable conversations around racism and things that happen every day, like microaggressions, code-switching, as well as privilege, which I don’t see as a dirty word. I’ve been taking about D&I for a long time, but we weren’t having those conversations in this context before. People had to get comfortable with being uncomfortable to address these topics.”

In the past year or two, Boatner observes the game has moved from talk to a focus on tangible actions to drive change: “I do believe that we are making the right steps, but there’s just so much more work to be done because after 400 years, there’s a lot of areas for improvement and it’s not going to be ticking a neat checklist,” she notes.

Opening The Door For Others, Wider Yet

Since becoming the first black woman to serve as the National President of the Public Relations Student Society of America (PRSSA), Boatner has been attuned to what it means to have either the presence or absence of those who walk before you.

“I was the first one, which confused me for an organization that had existed for over forty years,” says Boatner. “At the same time, there were several black women who had led the professional society, so that told me that when I graduated, if I ever wanted to PRSA president, somebody had laid the groundwork before me. I wouldn’t have to be the first this time.”

Boatner feels representation is so important and is inspired, not dissuaded, to be the change: “Whether a lot of people look like me in Corporate America leadership, it has to start somewhere – such as talking to historically black colleges about why PR is a viable career. My attitude is when I am in a position of power, there are people to open the door for, because a bunch opened the door for me to be where I am.”

Among those who have inspired and empowered her, she includes black female executives Judith Harrison, Renetta McCann, Helen Shelton, Debra Miller, and more trailblazing women: “Let’s leave our mark, they showed me, so that’s what I am trying to do. But I’ve never wanted to be black Brandi. It’s Brandi, rockstar and badass, and she just happens to be black.”

Outside her organization, Boatner has had her moments of confronting thinly veiled racist interactions – such as having to make her position in the room clear (and it’s to speak, not get the coffee) or tolerate being handled with kid gloves (such as being presented negative news in a way that seeks to pre-empt or manage the angry black woman stereotype).

When it comes to allyship, she says you have to stop playing safe and stop sitting on the sidelines: “If you’re not an agent of change, you’re literally just a spectator. You won’t roll up your sleeves. It’s great you want to be an ally, but I would really love an accomplice – somebody who can get me into the spaces that I can’t yet get in and can change the way people think and look, because they’re already in that space.”

Being Your Authentic Whole Self, Above the Challenges

Boatner is more at home speaking to a crowd of thousands than a room of a dozen people. She wants to be seen as the Beyoncé of the business world: “I want people to be like, she is a force, she is effervescent,” she says (which she is). “But at the end of the day, I am the epitome of realness. What you see is what you get, and I’m a lot for people to take. I know I live at a twelve on a ten scale, and I’ve tried to come down to a six but that feels uncomfortable, so I decided I’m going back to twelve. That’s who I am and that’s a leadership quality.”

She also values realness and aliveness in those she works with: “I like people who work towards a common goal. I don’t want the naysayers – the we can’ts or the woulda, shoulda, coulda’s. I like people who inspire and empower.”

Boatner makes a point to reach out to black women to encourage owning their roots and raise their vision beyond the possibilities they see for themselves: “I always tell young black women that your blackness is part of your uniqueness. No one can take that from you. I feel as a race and ethnicity, we have a unique set of characteristics and traits as black women that are all our own. And that is something to be proud of and that is something to be shared and that is something to be recognized and valued. No one, I mean no one, should take that from them, including themselves,” emphasizes Boatner. “They are sometimes their own worst enemy.”

She notes that many things are and will feel stacked against you and you’re going to run into hard days, racism and bigoted people, but she urges young black women to let none of that define their possibilities.

Resilience in The Wake of Trauma

Boatner’s greatest passion in her life is her family in New Orleans, and it’s together with her family that she has faced her most difficult challenges.

Sixteen years ago, her family lost their home in Hurricane Katrina, after the roof blew off their house and they were forced to flee and hunker in the storm, salvaging ultimately only what had been stored in a fire-resistant lockbox by her father, such as her birth certificate. And just last year, and exactly sixteen years to the day of this first devastating life-changing experience, Hurricane Ida struck New Orleans and again took her grandparents family home (where her mother grew up) and flooded her mother’s hometown.

Watching in horror from New York and praying not to see her family turn up on CNN, Boatner felt helpless, triggered by the past trauma of Katrina, and desperate to get her mom to New York: “It was incredibly difficult to go through that, and if it wasn’t for my colleagues and best friends, I don’t think I would have been able to get through it. Here I am the woman always trying to make things happen, and I couldn’t do anything. It was crippling and suffocating.”

Boatner had to “dig deep” and being a mindfulness leader supported her, but she reflects it would have been easy to go down a very dark path: “Talk about resilience – my family and the citizens of New Orleans are made of tough stuff because we’ve been through something terrible, now twice.” She notes that people often want to glamorize the survivor story, but when you’ve lived it, you don’t want to relive, dramatize or be defined by it.

“I love my family, I love my Louisiana, I love my tribe,” she says, grateful today that despite the impossible loss, everyone is here and well.

By Aimee Hansen

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Sharon Claffey Kaliouby: VP Strategic Alliances, Learning Pool

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Sharon Claffey KalioubyAs I matured through the corporate world, I saw that many organizations that don’t succeed in L&D are valuing what you know versus what you share,” says Sharon Claffey Kaliouby. “The learning approaches we’re focusing on are a catalyst for change, in creating opportunities to learn collaboratively to facilitate the business goals.”

As a leader in the field of learning and development (L&D), Kaliouby speaks to her life-long love of learning, why paradoxically breaking our educational conditioning is inherent to professional success, and the quandary of the L&D leadership gender gap.

Learning is About Sharing, Not Just Knowing

Named one of the Top 50 Leaders in Learning & Development in 2019 and honored as Learning Professional of the Year in 2018 by The Learning & Performance Institute, Kaliouby is passionate about helping organizations to drive their goals forward by building individual and organization-wide capabilities through education.

“You can spend your entire life doing something that everybody else thinks you should do,” she advises her own daughters. “Or you can do something you totally love and are passionate about, and feel truly alive. That’s the direction you should always go. Stick with your inner gut and don’t let anyone change your mind.”

Kaliouby worked in-house for nearly twenty years before making an intentional move to Learning Pool, a pioneering full-service customized e-learning provider working across a large international client base, from companies to NGOs to higher education.

Kaliouby speaks emphatically about reframing what we value in and how we experience learning: “As we go through our educational system, and almost anywhere in the world, there is one thing that collaboration is usually called: cheating. Collaboration in the school system is called cheating, so we’re educated not to collaborate.”

In academia, success often means not sharing your knowledge but that flips the moment we exit formal education. She notes women are disproportionately represented among top students but not top executives. The early displaced value on autonomous success can also stunt institutional development.

“Innovative organizations are sharing cultures who want employees to share their success and knowledge with other colleagues. You’re not elevated in the organization based on how much more you know than others, but how much you share the knowledge,“ observes Kaliouby.

Learning that Values Your Participation

With Learning Pool, the L&D objectives begin with asking what learning is going to be most directly valuable to the core organizational goals. The strategic approach is that learners not only comprehend the content, but are also involved in their education, with their participation being a factor in the measure of their learning success. Sharing (such as comments in an online forum) becomes weighted by the richness of knowledge the individual holds and shares, rather than their title.

Kaliouby is increasingly motivated by Learning Pool’s Learning Experience Platform (LXP) Stream, which is designed to enable the self-determined learner to find and to access particular courses they need or want for themselves. She points out that the rush to compulsory online education in the past eighteen months widely replicated the classroom rather than customizing education for the positive capabilities of this medium, and this has potentially created resistance to online learning among a whole generation of students. But at the same time, that challenging experience may compel reflection from those students, based on what they truly needed, that compels developments yet to come in the L&D space.

Going Back to Being Human and Being Learners

When it comes to remote working, ‘upskilling’ and ‘reskilling’ are part of the hot themes right now, and with Covid-19, the L&D field has moved towards the human side of business in many ways – such as skilling up on EQ, capacity for empathy and holistic communication skills.

“Some people that were hired as a CEO in 2018 were not equipped to be the chief empathy office of 2020 or 2021. But what’s nice is the human equation is now being valued, as much as learning data analytics in the scientific backgrounds were highly valued,” notes Kaliouby. “We need soft skills now because we’re all in crisis mode, but I hope it’s more than a trend.”

From her perspective, we’re circling back to the 1990’s when family and kids were invited into the office or gatherings. Whereas in the 2000’s, the 9/11 and financial crises put sustained employment into more jeopardy, and it became safer emotionally not to know each other so personally. With Zoom, we’re invited back into witnessing colleagues in their lives outside of work, and this impacts learning too.

“Now, we want learning to be about the whole person. When you’re learning something in your organization, to better the business goals, you also want to be building for yourself too,” says Kaliouby. “You’re building knowledge that’s going to make you a different, more insightful or more aware person, regardless of what the topic is.”

She notes that for the first time, a lot of people have the space and bandwidth to take up guitar or language lessons online, for example, rather than just be entertained. We are in some way becoming learners again, who wish to be effective in all spherical aspects of our lives.

Why Are There Too Few Women Leaders in L&D?

In 2013, Kaliouby became the co-founder of #WomeninLearning, which actively promotes women in learning and leadership – supporting an awareness of gender equality and an environment committed to a more diverse future. Bringing great talent into an industry is not the same as threading that talent up to leadership, and the gender gap at the top of L&D is astounding considering it’s a predominantly female field.

2019 research data showed that while women are coming into the learning field as 2/3 of support roles, and many assume women lead the field, they actually comprise less than 1/3 of senior authority roles at the leadership level. Compared to a male-dominated field like finance, Kaliouby notes, “It’s even worse news because we have more women in the learning sector, and we’re still flipping it: there’s more men than women leaders.”

#WomeninLearning has raised the conversation, even in the context of her own household: “I see my daughter, who is in the workforce, sharing her salary with her friends and speak adamantly that she can’t understand why the guys over there that didn’t do as well in school are making more money. They’re stating, ‘we’re not going to stand for this and we’re not going to stand for diversity of thought not to be valued’.”

Due to a recent company acquisition, Kaliouby has had the opportunity to become more familiar with Higher Education, and finds the approach to managing gender dynamics intriguing: “In Higher Education, the women actively state they don’t care about the title, but they want to earn equal pay. I think in the corporate world, we focused too much on wanting the right title, but if we’re never going to catch up on the salary, that’s to the side.”

Not only does the notion of not having equal room for women in leadership (“space for one”) work against women helping to bring other women up, but Kaliouby notes that the ‘confidence gap’ has a real basis in hiring trends: “Women are hired on their experience not their potential, and men are hired on their potential,” she says. “And that is the biggest disaster in regards to the gender gap in learning.” Women self-select themselves out of applying for a job if they do not have the exact background and this is even more limiting (we can’t get there if we are not even applying for the roles).

She notes that 94% of C-Suite women have all played a sport, and playing sports builds both a grit and resilience, as well as learning what you’re particularly skilled at, and what you’re not.

So she recommends picking up a new sport: “If you pick up something brand-new, you’ll know what it’s like to start and be an entry level person. You’ll know that awkward feeling, the ability not to fully understand your full map, and you might develop another angle of empathy as well.”

A two-time member of the USFA National gold medal women’s sabre fencing team herself, Kaliouby recently began a couple of new sports, including pickle ball. She accredits her athletic background for giving her a perseverance that has served her professional journey.

A Lifelong Appreciation of Self-Development

“I could have been a full-time student forever. That was always my desire, she says. “I do feel like I’m a lifelong learner now.”

When reflecting back on her passion and love for learning, Kaliouby feels the valuing of education in her Irish Catholic family home in Boston imprinted strongly upon her. She witnessed her father get his diploma while employed as a Policeman, and he emphasized to her that the one thing someone can never take away from you is your intelligence. He went on to become a university professor of criminal justice. Though she lost him young, her own passion for learning today carries on his legacy of the drive to realize further capacities and visions that are seeded within oneself.

Both of her daughters, top achievers academically, carried on the family legacy of valuing education and learned Arabic growing up (with mom auditing class with them as well), as their father is Egyptian. In addition to continuing her sports participation with fencing, pickle ball and more, learning sign language is the next personal stretch that Kaliouby has her eyes set on.

By: Aimee Hansen

Learning Pool offers innovative learning platforms not only including the LXP Stream, but also a Learning Management System and a Learning Record Store (LRS) titled Learning Locker (one of the most downloaded LRS’ in the world). Learning Pool also offers off the shelf courseware (as well as custom courses). Kaliouby is most proud of the Corporate Social Responsibility courses made available for ALL at no cost on their website – including courses focused on climate change, mental health, stress, anxiety and the uncomfortable truth of racial inequality.

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Noelle Ramirez: Project Manager, Diversity, Equity & Inclusion, PGIM

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Noelle Ramirez“I bring to the table my lived and learned experience as a woman, a lesbian woman, a Hispanic woman,” says Noelle Ramirez. “The things that kept me quiet in the room before are the things making me speak the loudest in the Diversity, Equity & Inclusion space.”

She speaks to showing up visibly to create belonging, how to expand the diversity of recruitment, and the prerequisite importance of culture.

Being The Representation You Want To See

Given her love for people and their stories, Ramirez chose to study immigration throughout her undergrad at Dartmouth. During recruiting season in college, she never saw herself, as a Puerto Rican woman, in asset management. Literally. The recruiters and classmates on that track did not look like her.

“I didn’t see myself, and the lack of representation was something that I shied away from,” she recalls. “But a lot of my perceptions were really misperceptions. I just did a talent research project at PGIM, where we found there’s a huge perception issue for the wealth and asset management industry felt by not only women, but also Latinx individuals, Hispanic individuals, black individuals: I don’t see myself, so how could I go that route?”

So when Ramirez moved to a focused diversity, equity and inclusion (DEI) role in asset management, she did so with intention.

“I can be the representation that I want to see and make an impact in an industry that needs more people like me,” she says. “Highlighting different voices is something I want to do—you don’t have to be a math major or male or straight in this industry. You can show up, do a good job and succeed. I found there’s some amazing, diverse people in this industry. They’re just not the voices we have traditionally highlighted first.”

Casting A Wider Net for Recruiting

“The most rewarding piece of my work is to create an opportunity and open a door, where traditionally that door may not have existed,” says Ramirez, “to be able to put that spotlight on someone who might not have been seen and say, ‘I see you and there’s space for you here.’”

In the Latinx talent space, Ramirez experienced one of her biggest moments of impact when she and a colleague dared to cast a wider net. They traveled to Hispanic-serving institutions in Florida, well outside of the typical target schools, and met Luisa Maria Machado Artimez, a first generation American who came to the US at the age of 12 from Cuba and served in the US Army for a year before starting college. Ramirez found Luisa to be “one of the most inspiring young women that I’ve ever worked with and probably will ever know.”

Ramirez and her colleague agreed they wanted to find a way to invite Luisa into the industry via an internship at PGIM. She joined the summer program, was a star performer and is returning next year.

“That’s why I do this work. It’s easy to make the case for casting a wider net when you know someone like Luisa has been brought into the organization and succeeded,” she says. That’s when the higher-level support comes and then you can create an entire strategy around that.”

Making the Business Case

“You’re not going to move mountains when it comes to DEI in a month, or even a year. We’re fighting things like systemic racism that have been in place for generations,” she says, “so it’s important to celebrate small wins.”

Ramirez emphasizes being strategic and data-driven in the DEI sphere.

“For some people, it really is showing them exactly what they are missing by not caring about this,” she notes, “creating that story and walking them to that finish line, so they can take the step to make the change in the organization.”

For example, one of her DEI focuses has been on identifying where core Latinx talent is concentrated in the organization, to establish allyship to support that talent in moving towards more leadership positions.

“The Latinx population is becoming the majority minority—this is, the fastest-growing population, a more educated and entrepreneurial population, set to become the majority homeowners in the next 20 years,” she observes. “If the industry doesn’t have a strategy that’s going to capitalize on this talent, we’re completely missing the boat from a business perspective.”

She notes the “three P” factors that are barriers to Latinx recruitment in the industry:

  • Perception: This is not an industry that I see anyone like me in.
  • Talent Pipeline: I don’t even know or understand what asset management is, so how would I choose it?
  • Passion & Purpose: Can I feel good and passionate about wealth creation?

“If we don’t know the barriers to address,” says Ramirez, “then how are we going to work towards them as an industry?”

“Job hunters today are looking for a career that aligns with their values and that they can feel good about – and rightly so, we should feel passionate about purposeful in the work we do every day.”

Ramirez feels there needs to be more emphasis on getting different voices out there to attract a diverse talent pool as well as sharing stories about how companies are doing good and can align with your values, like PGIM’s huge investment in the community of Newark, New Jersey.

Put Culture First and Create an Inclusive Environment

When it comes to advice on making career-related decisions, she tells others: “Culture first. Seek out advice from people that are already there. What has their experience been? Do they feel comfortable? Do they feel like they can bring who they are to the table? If the answer is yes, that’s a good place to start. It takes away a lot of productivity and energy to not be who you are.”

“Go somewhere where you can be yourself. I’m very passionate in my delivery and it’s part of my culture. Making sure I’m in an environment where that doesn’t have to be shut off is important,” she says. “Look for environments that are ready to receive you, because that’s where you’ll be your most productive, innovative, creative and strategic.”

Another core component of Noelle’s team’s work is to create a safe space so that people can comfortably share as little or as much about their own experience as they wish.

“I’m a lesbian. I can talk about my partner every Monday morning. I would say as an industry, we are behind in creating safer spaces where people can be 100% themselves,” she notes. “We have an LGBTQ+ Think Tank at PGIM, which is comprised of Out leaders across the organization, which is thinking of ways to highlight LGBTQ+ voices and to give them a platform to share and educate.”

For me, I made the conscious decision to be out at work, especially when I joined the DEI space, because I felt like there weren’t many out people that I could go to and seek advice from, and I wanted to be that for someone else.”

Of her own intersectional identity, Ramirez notes, “I’m a white passing person and there’s privilege in that. Early on in my career, it was much easier to just blend. But moving into the DEI space, all of the things that made it uncomfortable now instead legitimize me and give me a platform to stand on.”

“How am I going to show up today from my voice?” Ramirez notes it’s a daily struggle. “From your voice to your hair to your clothes to your delivery, these are not necessarily things that are on everyone else’s mind.”

Ramirez is a huge athlete and since her father introduced her two years ago, she’s been obsessed with one the world’s fastest growing sports: pickleball—which combines elements of badminton, table tennis and tennis.

Played by people of all ages, not only has it allowed her to get outdoors daily during the pandemic, but she’s also made close friends with people she would have never otherwise met. Though her partner is more inclined to music than sports, she also often joins Ramirez on the court.

By: Aimee Hansen

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Lindsay Rosner, CFA: Principal at PGIM Fixed Income

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Lindsay Rosner “What’s guided me throughout my career is looking for people who are both happy and genuinely interested in what they’re doing,” says Lindsay Rosner about her career journey. “I want to see that personal happiness factor.”

As a fixed income investor, Rosner can talk about the credit markets all day long, but when it comes to professional development she speaks to investing in yourself. For her that means taking your seat at the table and not being afraid to bring your whole self to work.

During the pandemic, she’s seen more kids, dogs, and spouses than she ever imagined could enter the workplace, but those interactions have helped bring a real human element to business, and for Rosner that’s a step in the right direction.

Insisting on Personal Happiness Factor

While every job has its grunt work – she remembers taking breakfast orders as a Wall Street intern – Rosner looks for work that enlivens her and the people around her.

“I started on Wall Street right out of college. There were some unhappy people,” she recalls. “Fortunately, I worked with quite a few clients who were happy. So, I tried to find myself a job that would prove both professionally challenging and personally satisfying.”

Rosner loves constantly learning, addressing problems, finding solutions and being part of developing and implementing new products.

Recently, she’s animated by exchange traded funds (ETFs) in the fixed income space, allowing access to diversified investments with lower dollar amounts, as well as Environmental Social Governance (ESG) factors and increasingly ESG funds. While governance has always been fundamental to the bottom-up credit analysis conducted by Rosner and her PGIM Fixed Income colleagues, she enjoys being part of the broader ESG conversation which increasingly has shifted to include not only an emphasis on governance, but also social and environmental criteria.

ESG factors are more and more part of the conversations Rosner has with her institutional and retail clients, but also part of the conversations credit analysts are having with Chief Financial Officers and Treasurers because those factors can and do impact the cost of financing.

Investing in Your Value Equation

Early in her career, Rosner was positioned in the equities division of Lehman Brothers as the firm was going under. She found herself in a precarious position that she has not since forgotten and that has informed her decisions.

“Two years out of college on the trading floor means that you are only beginning to understand the markets and risks of positions. You’re deftly quick in putting together the morning meeting packets, have mastered ordering lunch for 40 people and frequently assist senior traders; However, you aren’t in the driver seat yet.” she states. “When Lehman was facing bankruptcy, I saw all the more senior people who I’d been assisting every day interviewing to get their lives figured out, and I quickly learned I needed more marketable skills and a wider network.”

As Barclays purchased Lehman Brothers, Rosner was never out of a job, but realizing she was on her own was a harrowing experience that taught her a valuable lesson: “I will never put myself in a position again where I don’t have the skills. If something happens totally out of your control, you have to be ready.”

Despite many views on the trading floor that a CFA designation was not necessary for a trading role, Rosner attained her CFA as a personal insurance policy and to fortify her credentials. Rosner has since chosen to keep her knowledge and skillset wide, rather than niche.

“Even within your organization, you have to think about the opportunities for specific roles or jobs through the lens of what is best for you,” she says. “For me, I’ve always chosen to pursue roles that are broader.”

Claiming Your Seat at The Table

Rosner emphasizes that you have to actively claim your seat at the table and occupy it with your whole self.

“If you want to be involved in the conversation, you don’t sit in the seat in the back of the conference room,” she asserts. “If there are not more seats, you should pull your chair up to the table and get involved to the appropriate degree.”

Rosner admits she has leaned towards over-preparation in claiming that seat.

“Diversity is not where I’d like it to be in the industry. That’s not only from the gender standpoint. It’s racial diversity as well. I care tremendously to see that change,” says Rosner. “With fewer senior women, I always over-prepare. If that comes across as confidence, I’ve made it look easy. But the fact is, I have a lot to prove.”

But she has also learned to embody her own skin fully.

“You get to a point in your life where you realize you have to be yourself. The path forward isn’t going to happen unless you are,” states Rosner. “That means bringing all of you to the table, not being ashamed to talk about having children, etc. There are times where I will question if the analogy I use, or story I tell, will resonate with the room, but you have to be yourself to be successful.”

Bringing Your Whole Self

“I speak loud. I use my hands. I’m pretty emotive. I have a lot of facial expressions. I bring a little bit of my personal life into my work life, whereas some draw a hard-line,” says Rosner. “I just think, this is the whole me. You need all of it.”

When starting out, she remembers taking training classes for client lunches. “There’s so much importance placed on professionalism, and some of it is so contrived,” she observes. “At the end of the day, these are people too who you’re working with.”

Rosner has long invited back her sense of self-deprecating humor to the office, as part of what helps build connection and relationships, and part of her own professionalism.

“You don’t connect with people when it’s all buttoned up. I love being a storyteller, telling a story and making people laugh,” she says. “We all have those relatable, funny moments and experiences and people will remember those interactions.”

“You’re not always going to connect by talking about a company’s balance sheet. Instead, be vulnerable. Being yourself allows others to be themselves,” she notes. “People value that you remember their kid was going to an important doctor’s appointment and ask what occurred. That’s being real.”

Building Your Village

“I think everybody needs a village. So much is building that village of men and/or women who support you, professionally or personally,” notes Rosner. “It’s all give and take. You have to help somebody in order to get it back.”

While she’s found you can learn from any partnership, Rosner has often benefited the most from the informal mentorships where “often you don’t realize it’s a mentorship until later,” even when the benefit might be tough love.

“Everyone can offer something. There are different times in your career where you’ll need different people so it’s important to keep those contacts,” she notes. “You may not need them for three years, but in a moment you realize that person is the perfect person to give advice on this issue, and you reach out to them.”

On the flip-side, Rosner notes that seeing people who she mentored do well is as rewarding and fulfilling as if it were her own success.

Working From Home

With a three year old and a twenty month old at home, Rosner has enjoyed and needed the flexibility of the remote workplace, whereas the previous expectation was full team presence on the trading floor. The pandemic has put into consideration whether that’s as critical as once believed.

Rosner notes that the remote workspace has brought more recognition and valuing of a perspective that women have always been able to offer.

“Women really have a pulse on what’s going on in the family and the balance sheet of basic consumers in the country,” says Rosner. “You can bring that kind of knowledge to bear, and it’s actually valuable in my work setting now.”


She’s also found the remote workplace means she can be available more easily to chat with others when it comes to mentoring and networking, and even more so with those outside of her organization.

Rosner loves spending time outdoors with her little ones and is enjoying the arrival of spring.

By Aimee Hansen

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Leah Meehan: Enterprise Data Governance, Measurement and Reporting, State Street

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Leah Meehan“The most important thing is to listen to your gut. Whatever it is, the voice in your head, there’s something that just drives you,” says Leah Meehan. “I have zero regrets in life because I’ve made every decision I had to make with the best information I had at the time.”

Meehan also talks about translating between worlds, the most important time you’ll ever invest in, diversifying your personal board of directors and creating balance through a fake commute.

Listening To Your Gut

With a master’s degree in criminal justice from Boston University, Meehan’s path threw a curveball. After about five years of working as a Correctional Program Officer, Meehan knew that civil service was not for her.

She did not resonate with the annual cycle of indiscriminate pay raises for which performance was irrelevant. She was one of four women out of a class of 84, and often had to remind herself that she had earned her place there as a woman, just like everyone. But what leaving really came down to was the undeniable knowing in her gut and heart.

“I started talking about leaving, and people thought it was crazy because the retirement package is so good and the stability and pay are good,” she recalls. “But it was one of those things in my gut that I knew I had to do, no matter, and I’m so glad I did.”

Once she first crossed to the private sector with Fidelity Investments, Meehan was involved in employee background investigations and from there she moved to analyzing behaviors related to money laundering. From there, she eventually moved towards her current focus on data governance, now with State Street.

Translating Between Two Worlds

With data and analytics becoming an even bigger part of our lives, Meehan’s work is moving and expanding, faster than ever.

She loves the ability to reach through the hard evidence of the data to prove or disprove something that the client perceives, sometimes opening up a whole area of insight they had not even considered.

“I’m a visual person and when you visualize data, it’s amazing how that can get across to people in different ways and in different languages. It doesn’t matter if you’re an introvert, an extrovert, a data person or not,” Meehan says. “When you see a visualization you know what that means—there is an art to that.”

To craft a compelling story for her clients with the data, she has to be able to listen closely and bridge the numbers with what is important to them.

“If you’re not gearing your data towards your audience, it can be totally lost on them, or falsely interpreted,” says Meehan. “You have to understand what the client is doing, what’s important to them, what their end goals are, what their process is, how they view success or failure and then you need to interpret that in the data.

“I think my job over the last 15 years has developed to be an interpreter between the technical and the business side,” she continues. “That middle section is where I live.”

Investing In Fostering Connection

Meehan feels that the most valuable mentor-mentee relationships she has developed over the years are those that came together informally, through meeting casually and recognizing a connection.

“I’ve also been lucky throughout my career to have several people sponsor me, and I mean they would go into a room and fight for me—a job, a raise, a promotion, taking on a new project,” she says. ”I’ve been fortunate to have that, and I’ve also worked hard at fostering those relationships.”

Meehan recognizes that with work to do and often pending deadlines, dropping everything to go for a half hour coffee can sometimes feel like time not well spent.

“But to me, it’s the most important time,” she iterates. “If you make those personal connections with people, it will help you down the road, personally and professionally.”

Even now, she finds nothing more rewarding as a manager than watching her team members grow and advance to dreams they have aspired to, no matter where it might take them.

“I encourage that, and to think I had a small part in their progress makes me happy,” reflects Meehan. “When I see my team doing well, spread out over the years at various firms doing what they love, and still coming back to me to let me know how they are or to ask for references, that’s what makes me the most proud.”

Diversifying Her Board of Directors

Meehan is a big believer in cultivating your own personal board of directors—the people that you can call on as advisors from a personal and professional standpoint. Recently, she’s been focusing on bringing in a greater diversity of perspectives to bounce ideas off of.

“I realized the people I go to often are very similar to me, so when I go to them for advice, they’re probably going to give me what I want to hear,” she observes. “So I have one person on my board who has been a friend for a long time, and he tells me ‘how it is’. He does not hold anything back, to the point it sometimes upsets me, but he’s helping me to move ahead; I need more of those people, to diversify my board.”

Creating Balance in Covid Times

Certainly the remote working office has impacted office dynamics, including going from wearing a suit everyday to yoga pants. But the stronger impact for Meehan has been on her work-life balance.

“In the beginning of Covid, we thought we were the lucky ones because all of our friends with kids were really struggling with homeschooling,” says Meehan, speaking for her husband and herself. “But then we went through a period where we worked more online, and our work-life balance got thrown completely off.”

Meehan realized that her friends with children at least had some consistent schedule of making dinner, putting kids to bed. Her husband and her did not have the external pulls on attention, so could work into the night and barely make dinner.

“We had to take a step back and create some boundaries,” says Meehan.

In her remote home office in Boston, she has now created a “fake commute” at both the beginning and end of her workday to mimic the transition of her twenty minute walk to work—she goes on a walk and may do yoga or meditation. She blocks off an hour in the middle of the day as well for herself, and has dinner with her husband.

Together they share a passion for travel, have summited Mount Kilimanjaro a few years back and are bound for Antarctica in 2023.

By Aimee Hansen

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