Voice of Experience: Shona Milne, CFO EMEA, Deutsche Bank

By Melissa J. Anderson (New York City)

After spending more than twenty-five years in investment banking in London, Shona Milne has taken on quite a few big roles. Now CFO for EMEA and Managing Director of EMEA Finance at Deutsche Bank’s London office, Milne is responsible for 27 countries.

But today, she’s also passionately focused on her position as a role model for women and LGBT individuals at the firm.

“I suppose I should be telling you my proudest achievements have been something like building a global finance function for equities or EMEA,” she said. “But actually what gives me more pride is my involvement in Deutsche Bank’s diversity networks, particularly being a senior sponsor of the LGBT network.”

“A few years ago I realized that I had to give something back, that I had the ability as a Managing Director to be a positive role model. There are not many people who are out at the Managing Director level, and it’s a privilege for those of us who are to be able to make a difference on this topic.”

She mentioned her involvement in Deutsche Bank’s web videos on diversity, participation in chairing diversity networks, and speaking on LGBT issues at events. “It’s incredibly rewarding. And maybe as you get older you become more comfortable about doing these things. You want to be a role model, not just for LGBT, but for senior women as well, and other diversity networks.”

“That gives me personal pride,” she added.

Career in Finance

After earning a first in mathematics at St. Andrews University, Milne trained in Edinburgh as a chartered accountant. She began her career at Deloitte and became a manager. “Then I saw the bright lights of the City of London,” she recalled.

She explained, “The American banks had arrived in the City and it was all very exciting and different. I joined the onset of investment banking in London about thirty years ago.”

After working at Morgan Stanley for a short time, Milne moved to a British merchant bank that was eventually acquired by Deutsche Bank. “I’ve stayed with Deutsche Bank for 24 years,” she recalled. “I’ve had lots of different roles within the organization, primarily in the finance space. Deutsche Bank created its investment bank from scratch about fifteen years ago, and my role was to create a global finance function in a relatively short amount of time. In the last few years I’ve been at the CFO level.”

Milne was CFO for Deutsche Bank’s global equities business, then moved into regional CFO functions, latterly being CFO for EMEA.

But there were challenges when she first started out, she said. One of the things she wishes she had learned sooner was the importance of speaking up. “Undoubtedly as a woman or any individual in the financial world it’s important to make your voice heard. People are paying you to make sure your voice is heard in your organization.”

“It’s easy to think nobody wants to hear what you have to say, but everybody has a contribution to give and it took me quite a few years to realize my voice is just as good – or, many times, better,” she continued with a laugh. “Women have to make their voices heard. We tend to sit back and assume someone’s voice is better than ours.”

She added, “This applies to anyone managing their career, but women specifically.”

Currently, Milne says one of her more interesting projects is the integration of a company Deutsche Bank acquired in the Netherlands. “We’re coming up on completion next month after two or three years of the hard work of many people.”

She is also interested in challenges of efficiency and complexity. “Sitting in the finance space, as a CFO, one of the biggest difficulties we face in banking certainly is the complexity of processes and systems. This is true at every major corporation. The difficulties in streamlining processes and systems and making organizations more efficient is something that faces every CFO on a day to day basis.”

Passion for Diversity

Milne says she has realized new-found excitement in diversity in the past few years. “The diversity work excites me in a passionate way as I’m serving as a role model in the diversity space.”

She continued, “I’ve learned over the past few years – and it took me a long time to learn this – that you have to ask, in the work environment, are women different from men or are we all the same? In my mind, women do have different needs and desires in terms of what motivates them.”

Milne recalled sitting on a committee for a ‘women in business’ conference in London four or five years ago. Attendees were polled via an electronic voting system on career topics. “When the women were asked if they had asked for a pay rise, only about ten percent said yes. Only ten percent said they had asked for a promotion. When asked if they had told their boss what a great job they’d done on a project, the response was again only about ten percent. Then we saw the same stats for men, and the responses were all about eighty percent or more.”

“It demonstrated to me how different we are and how to appreciate these differences in managing our careers. The reality is that there are differences in the way people are motivated.”

Milne also serves as Co-Chair of Deutsche Bank’s LGBT network in London, DB Pride. “It’s fascinating and it’s empowering and it’s very interesting,” she said. She explained that some members of senior management are often surprised about the challenges LGBT individuals face in the workplace. “When you sit down with senior management and talk about what it’s like for people who are lesbian or gay, senior people say they don’t understand why it’s still an issue. You hear, ‘I don’t treat anyone differently’ or ‘my best friend is gay!’”

“Trying to explain that this is still an issue is a challenge. Although it’s become a lot less of an issue over the past few years, especially in Europe where governments are making major advances in LGBT equality. But even though there are huge advances, there’s still a huge percentage of people who are not out at work. There’s still a real business case for saying it’s important for companies to focus on talking to staff and senior people encouraging individuals to bring their whole selves to work,” she explained, citing improved performance and an increased bottom line.

She continued, “I think an important message is that we haven’t won the battle yet – there’s still a lot of fear in the minds of LGBT employees over whether they will be discriminated against.”

Milne praised Deutsche Bank’s UK CEO Colin Grassie for speaking publicly about challenges that LGBT employees contend with at work.

Advice for Women in Finance

“My advice for junior women is to be good at what you do. It’s a competitive world out there now,” Milne said. “Strive to do your best. Challenge yourself.”

She continued, “Don’t be afraid to ask questions. Make your voice heard – believe you have something to say. You will be adding value.”

“I would hate to say that women have to be better than men to succeed, but you have to really demonstrate that you are absolutely capable.” She encouraged senior women to be more willing to talk about their achievements. “Put your head above the parapet and make sure your opinions are coming across in a way that sells your story. It’s about making yourself heard.”

“Even at senior levels women tend to hold back,” she explained. “Women think guys are talking for the sake of talking, but the guys wonder why women aren’t contributing. You have to give your opinion because it will be valuable and it’s the only way to succeed at senior levels of the organization.”

Milne explained that women’s development initiatives were few and far between when she began her career, but in the past few years, she has begun to recognize their value. “We have some very good and very progressive programs that make a difference for women now, including our ATLAS program.”

She pointed out that the firm was honored by Opportunity Now for its ATLAS program recently, and was also named a Top 50 Employer for Women by The Times.

“When I began my career, we were out there on our own, and I think women had much slower career paths because of it. I’ve seen a significant improvement over the past fifteen years, but we’re still not there yet.”

In Her Personal Time

Outside work, Milne is a keen golfer. “It’s one of my key passions. Being Scottish, it always has been.”

She added, “It’s a great way to relax, with plenty of fresh air, exercise, and good company.”